‘I did feel like vomiting in that first two weeks’, with Independent MP Kate Chaney

Today we continue the new series Vignettes from the Source, featuring some of the unforgettable, transformative moments my guests have shared over the years. This one is from a little over three years ago. It’s the first and last six minutes or so, bridged together, of my very first conversation with Kate Chaney. Kate was to become, just a few months later, the 7th new community independent – and WA's first – elected to Australia’s parliament at the 2022 election. 

Well, on Saturday week, 3 May, Australia’s next federal election takes place, and Kate is standing again, amongst all able incumbents, and many others. We heard on last week’s episode of the continued burgeoning community independents movement, along with the escalated personal assaults, generally negative and often false campaigning being waged against them. Kate was mentioned as being particularly targeted. 

It made me think of this first time Kate and I spoke, by Galup/Lake Monger in Perth, partly for the start, where she described her gut-churning time deciding whether she’d step up into this maelstrom in response to the community’s call. And partly for the end, where I asked about her vision for the country, and if she had a rallying cry of sorts for us. Her answer feels all the more poignant given how many more independents are standing this time. I’ve also never forgotten Kate’s story behind her music choice (I offer my suggestion too).

Hear the full conversation in episode 110, after Kate won in episode 121, and most recently on some of the enormous outcomes during her term in episode 203.

Get involved everywhere via the Community Independents Project.

Chapter markers & transcript.

Originally recorded 22 February 2022.

Music:

Intro by Jeremiah Johnson.

Stones & Bones, by Owls of the Swamp.

Regeneration, by Amelia Barden.

The RegenNarration playlist, chosen by guests.

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Kate Chaney
• 2:43 Kate's Decision to Enter Politics
• 5:10 Climate Change and Political Representation
• 7:01 Women's Role in Political Transformation
• 10:56 Vision for Australia's Future
• 14:12 Closing Thoughts and Meaningful Music

Transcript

AJ: 0:05

G'day Anthony James here for The RegenNarration, your community-supported independent podcast. Today we continue the new series Vignettes from the Source, featuring some of the unforgettable transformative moments my guests have shared over the years. This one is from a little over three years ago. It's the first and last six minutes or so bridged together, of my very first conversation with Kate Chaney. Kate was to become, just a few months later, the seventh new community independent and Western Australia's first elected to Australia's parliament at the 2022 federal election. Well, on Saturday week, the 3rd of May, Australia's next election takes place and Kate is standing again amongst all able incumbents and many others.

AJ: 0:54

We heard on last week's episode of the continued burgeoning community independents movement, along with the escalated personal assaults, generally negative and often false campaigning being waged against them. Kate was mentioned as being particularly targeted. To say I and so many of us have had a gutful of that is to put it lightly. It made me think of this first time Kate and I spoke by Galup / Lake Monger in Perth. , artly for the start, where she described her gut-churning time deciding whether she'd step up into this maelstrom in response to the community's call, and partly for the end, where I asked about her vision for the country and if she had a rallying cry of sorts for us locally and nationally. Her answer feels all the more poignant now, given how many more independents are standing this time.

AJ: 1:46

I've also never forgotten Kate's story behind her music choice to close A fortuitous moment, both deeply personal and now still uncannily political. I offer my suggestion for her too. If you're inspired to revisit the rest of this conversation, I'll put a link to what was episode 110 in the show notes, along with our conversation after she won for episode 121 and our most recent from just before we left Australia a year ago, on some of the enormous outcomes during her term for episode 203. There are some photos on those webpages too. And of course, to get behind your community candidate in Curtin with Kate or elsewhere, see today's show notes. But right now let's go back to these touchstone moments from the very beginning. Here's Kate. So I'm curious where you were when the call came to stand.

Kate: 2:43

I know to stand. I know well, I got. I got two separate messages, I think, one on linkedin and one via text message on the same day, which was would you be interested in having a conversation with this curtain independent group? And um. We were heading off to rottnest that day for five days of camping at Rottnest and um, and I actually took a call, or took a call at the ferry, um, and then the next day had a video conference with six or seven people from the campground, um, and really it was.

Kate: 3:24

I um realize it was going to be changing the course of my life at that point and probably for the first, and then I spent a lot of time in the next couple of weeks on the phone talking to different people, um, having a good hard think, really examining for myself too is this something that I could do with integrity? And, be true to myself, I had a good hard think about am I actually aligned to one or the other of the major parties, and was quite methodical about trying to understand what do I believe about this and what do each of the major parties believe about this, to really get a sense of whether it's the right direction. And I did feel like vomiting for a lot of the time in that first two weeks, just that sense of, um, this, there are a lot of reasons not to go into politics and, um, you know it comes at some personal cost. But that, that feeling that, uh, it needs to be done, the time is now, and the slow realisation that I probably am quite well positioned to represent that groundswell that's arising.

Kate: 4:36

So, yeah, I felt pretty nervous about whether it was the right decision and then, since launch, it has really affirmed that it is the right decision because it needs to be done. The energy is there, um, the opportunity is now and it's quite that. That's quite an exciting thing. I think to to to realize that change is possible, it can happen and that I can be part of. That is really um, it's invigorating. And if you're feeling frustrated and like there's, you know there are problems but there's nothing you can do about it, actually being given a channel somewhere to channel that energy is a very positive step, I think.

AJ: 5:18

Yeah, yeah. Was there something in particular that was really, I don't know, almost catalytic in your deciding to accept the challenge, something that really dug deep into your heart as to why that clinched the deal, sort of thing?

Kate: 5:35

um, there are probably a few things I I think, um the idea. So climate change is a big part of my why I'm running and the and probably seeing the independents across the country who share some things in common, and realizing that there was the potential in this federal election for independents to make a real change to Australian climate change policy, I did think how can I have that opportunity and not take it? So that was a big part of it. Also, I suppose the number of people that I spoke to confidentially before I launched, who just expressed hope and relief at the idea of it, made me feel like there's a need here to be filled. I mean, on the personal front, there are lots of risks and you don't know who's going to throw what sort of mud, which is part of the problem.

Kate: 6:49

The people that we need to be going into politics are the ones who wouldn't do it because it's a horrible game, and I know lots of people who I think would make a great contribution to the country who are not in a position to do it for various different reasons. I'm luckily in a position where I can take four months off work. I have a supportive husband and family got good mental health and physical health pretty strong in terms of my sense of who I am. So I think I have the fortitude to do it and really it was not one particular thing, it was a whole lot of things lining up together that made me think I'm going to regret not doing this more than I'll regret doing it.

AJ: 7:35

Yeah, interesting, I do think. I mean, certainly one of the things that hits me increasingly these days is the how, how people are feeling everything you've described really strongly, and so we can talk about the young people, we can obviously talk about indigenous peoples, and I even just think the fact that we've we still call ourselves battlers you know the aussie battler thing we're the richest civilization and country, for that matter, that's ever lived how can we have as a norm the idea that we're battling and that life is that way and that that's to be then exploited politically? You know, it feels like it's in keeping with the whole thing. Again, you know, and you talked about the people that wouldn't stand, and historically that's probably included a lot of women, and that's obviously been a flash point with parliament in the last year or so. Yet most of the independent candidates coming up are women. So there's something, there's a response, it seems in the air to the moment across the board.

Kate: 8:42

I think women. So I'm 47, I think women by the time they get to my age. I certainly feel like you've just got to get on with it and get it done, and I feel like I've had experience in different parts of my life and some success in different parts of my life. I've got less to prove and more interest in just using my one wild and precious life for something worthwhile, and I do think that there's something about women in their late 40s you know 50s who just want to get on and get it done.

AJ: 9:31

But then it's not just well.

AJ: 9:33

In a sense one of the global advocates, paul Hawken in this space says it's not so much decarbonisation, it's re-carbonisation Draw down the carbon from the atmosphere back into the soils where it belongs, where it's been depleted.

AJ: 9:46

So there's a sort of a renewables aspect, a shifting of the energy system, the industrial energy system, and then there's this drawdown aspect that puts carbon back in its place, sort of thing that there's a taste of even more opportunity. And when I have some of the discussions I'm having around the country, they include First Nations with what they're coming to call therapeutic, even, and certainly cultural economies, where there's a way of expressing value and receiving value from their enormous knowledge and skill, either through what we might glibly call tourism or bush products. But there's actually so much more. There's actually a broader context which is all derived from who do we want to be, where do we want to be? How well do we want to be in that 10, 20, 30 years? It's that real intergenerational focus. So when you say opportunity, I just see it flashing up everywhere. If we're prepared to make the leap, entertain it, back it in.

Kate: 10:51

And that leap is shifting our focus from the next three years to the next 50 years.

AJ: 10:56

Yes. Or even the next 10 would do yes, yes.

Kate: 11:01

But just changing that focus and thinking about all that we have to be so grateful for here in Australia, and how do we ensure that in 20 years, 30 years, 40 years, we still feel really grateful for you know, we still are flourishing in all the different senses of that word.

AJ: 11:21

Indeed, yeah, on that note, kate, how would you sum your vision for the country in those sorts of timeframes?

Kate: 11:32

Well, I think we should be really looking for a flourishing economy that delivers great outcomes for healthy communities. Really and I could probably wordsmith it a little- bit.

Kate: 11:53

But really the focus is we can't ignore the fact that our material position is very relevant to the standard of living that we appreciate that we have. But healthy communities has got to be at the heart of that, and that includes our relationship with land, our physical health, the health of other species as well, because ultimately that's what people really care about, that's what influences your life and some of the shifts we see in mental health and social isolation and loneliness and these issues that go beyond GDP but have a big impact on our happiness. So we've got to look at the system as a whole and we've got so much potential as a country. So really trying to build, trying to work towards that flourishing society is what I think government should be focused on the whole time really.

AJ: 12:53

Hear, hear. Do you want to end with a rallying cry for not just locals but, of course, people with independent candidates not just coming up? Even? Perhaps there are some that still haven't elected an independent candidate but they have a voices group or whatever a Curtin Independent equivalent. They might be moving towards one, but certainly for your campaign as much as any an invitation you'd like to put out to people.

Kate: 13:16

Yeah, I mean for people who are in Curtin, I would say have a good look at the alternatives, because I do think that what I stand for is consistent with a lot of people in Curtin. Now you actually do have an alternative in Curtin, so have a good look at it. Broader, outside Curtin, my call would be less about the independent movement per se and more about political engagement. So, whatever you stand for, take your responsibility as a citizen seriously, because the system is broken and we are the system, so it's not someone else's problem. Look at what's on offer, think about what you can do about it and don't underestimate your ability to have an impact, because it's only through people standing up and saying I expect more and I want to be part of that change, but we will see change, so don't wait for someone else to do it.

AJ: 14:16

Yes, a culture of engagement, the restoration of that. Yes, underline Now did you get the tip that we end each episode with a question about a piece of music? Did you get that tip?

Kate: 14:29

I did, I just remembered.

AJ: 14:33

A piece of music that's been significant for you in your life.

Kate: 14:37

Okay, so I've got one. It's a little bit silly.

AJ: 14:40

Awesome.

Kate: 14:42

This was my husband and I called this our song because we remembered a particular night at the Chelsea Tavern back when it was a thing on the dance floor quite early in our in our relationship, where we were dancing to this song. And then, when the campaign started, I was at the Rottnest pub and this song came on and I looked at Bill and said, not not only are they playing our song, but this kind of sums up where we are in this campaign. And that song is Stuck in the Middle with you Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right. Hopefully it doesn't evoke memories of Pulp Fiction and the scene from that movie, but I did think that it could be our, our sort of informal campaign theme song totally good.

AJ: 15:37

You don't play it on guitar or anything, do you? We could patch it in right now.

Kate: 15:40

I don't, I don't. I could pull out the ukulele, but I won't put you through it even better.

AJ: 15:45

You know. You know this speaks to my generation and perhaps my maleness, I don't know. But there's a part in Do you remember Rocky, the movie Rocky. I do remember Rocky and you remember where Adrian doesn't want him to fight because he's getting hurt, and then there's a moment where she gives him permission to fight, but on one condition that he wins and the bell tolls. May you win. Power to your arm, Kate. Thanks a lot for joining me.

Kate: 16:09

Thanks so much, anthony, thank you.