The RegenNarration Podcast
The RegenNarration podcast features the stories of a generation that is changing the story, enabling the regeneration of life on this planet. It’s ad-free, freely available and entirely listener-supported. You'll hear from high profile and grass-roots leaders from around Australia and the world, on how they're changing the stories we live by, and the systems we create in their mold. Along with often very personal tales of how they themselves are changing, in the places they call home. With award-winning host, Anthony James.
The RegenNarration Podcast
The Jefferson Street Sound: Preserving Nashville's Soul with Lorenzo Washington
Nashville's musical legacy extends far beyond the mainstream country narrative. Tucked away in North Nashville, the Jefferson Street Sound Museum stands as a testament to the rich cultural heritage of jazz, soul, and rhythm and blues that thrived from the 1940s to the 70s. Founded and curated by Lorenzo Washington, this museum isn't just a collection of artifacts – it's a living, breathing continuation of the African American music and community that shaped generations.
We’re talking about artists like Jimi Hendrix, Etta James, James Brown, Little Richard, Peggy Gaines, Jimmy Church, Jackie Shane, Ike and Tina Turner and many more, when they played the many clubs that lined Jefferson Street, alongside the local enterprises that provided ‘everything you need to sustain a community’. That was until around half a century ago, when the construction of Interstate 40 displaced more than a thousand black residents, destroyed a business and cultural district on Jefferson Street that was thriving against the odds, and cut the neighbourhood in half.
Lorenzo tells of how ‘black museums start in the kitchen’ – literally – and his was no different. What he thought might last a year or so has since grown to consume his entire house, win multiple awards, and spawn a new generation of folk taking up the mantle. The brilliant short film on PBS, Exit 207, opens with Lorenzo walking astride young leader Carlos Partee, founder of the Nashville Black Market, just part of the cultural and economic resurgence on and around Jefferson Street. And Lorenzo’s open mic nights, recording studio, community events, conversations with legends and more, continue not just to preserve a legacy, but to create one.
I met up with this dapper, funny, humble and still sprightly 82-year-old at the Museum, as he was gearing up for the Annual Gala on April 3 - in honor of what is now Lorenzo Washington Day in Nashville TN. We end up with a song made for him at the Museum by Nashville’s Queen of the Blues, Marion James.
Recorded 11 March 2025.
Title slide: Lorenzo outside the Museum after our chat (pic: Olivia Cheng).
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Music:
Watch Out, by Chaun Davis (from Artlist).
Regeneration, by Amelia Barden.
The RegenNarration playlist, music chosen by guests.
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I decided that I was not going to allow the legacy of these great artists and musicians, and especially the ones that didn't make it to stardom. I was not going to let them down. You know, I was going to do something to keep their heads held high, and that's what I did with this little museum, because now it's being known around the world, not just here in Nashville.
AJ:Nashville's musical legacy extends far beyond the mainstream country narrative. Tucked away in North Nashville, the Jefferson Street Sound Museum stands as a testament to the rich cultural heritage of jazz, soul and rhythm and blues that thrived from the 1940s through to the 70s. Bounded and curated by Lorenzo Washington, this museum isn't just a collection of artifacts. It's a living, breathing continuation of the African-American music and community that shaped generations. We're talking about artists like Jimi Hendrix, etta James, james Brown, little Richard, peggy Gaines, jimmy Church, frank Howard, jackie Shane, ike and Tina Turner, and so many more, when they played the many clubs that lined Jefferson Street alongside the local enterprises that provided everything you need to sustain a community. That was until around a half a century ago, when the construction of Interstate 40 displaced more than a thousand black residents, destroyed a business and cultural district on Jefferson Street that was thriving against the odds and cut the neighborhood in half. Lorenzo tells of how black museums start in the kitchen, literally, and his was no different. What he thought might last a year or so has since grown to consume his entire house, win multiple awards and spawn a new generation of folk taking up the mantle. The brilliant short film on PBS Exit 207, opens with Lorenzo, walking astride young leader, carlos Partee, founder of the Nashville black market, just part of the cultural and economic resurgence on and around Jefferson Street, and Lorenzo's open mic nights, recording studio community events, conversations with legends and more continue to not just preserve a legacy but create one G'day.
AJ:Anthony James, here for The RegenNarration, your independent, listener-supported podcast exploring how people are regenerating the systems and stories we live by with. Thanks to new subscribers on Substack Rowena Morrow and Gabrielle Mann. Thanks, sister. And to the good men clocking up three years of treasured support on Patreon Mike Mouritz, Reuben Parker-Greer, Rob Scott and John Macpherson. If you've been thinking about joining this brilliant community of supporting listeners and readers, I'd love you to. For as little as a dollar a week, with benefits if you like, you can help keep the show on the road. Subscribe free or paid on Patreon or Substack. Just follow the links in the show notes and thank you.
AJ:When I met up with this dapper, funny, humble and still sprightly 82-year-old at the museum, he was gearing up for the annual gala on April 3, in honour of what is now Lorenzo Washington Day in Nashville, tennessee. We're greeted at the door by the museum's VP, karen Coffee, before being joined by Lorenzo, and we end up with a song produced for him at the museum by Nashville's Queen of the Blues, marion James. I've been hanging out to bring you this one. Let's head to Jefferson Street, all right. Just arrived at the museum, you can tell by my backdrop of sound. It gives you a little hint of what destroyed the scene of Jefferson Street, but we'll hear more about it from the man himself.
AJ:Hey Karen, how are yo G?
AJ:how are you Good, good.
Karen:Good. Over to us right here.
AJ:Thanks for squeezing me in.
Karen:Yeah, you're the last that we're doing. He's in there. He probably want to start in here.
AJ:Yeah.
Karen:I'll lay a paper there for you If you want to take that back to Australia.
AJ:Oh cool. Thank you, Great Thanks for thinking of that.
Karen:And the e ad about the gala o t wonderful a the gala shaping up.
Karen:Oh, cool magazine. Did you see scene magazine?
AJ:I haven't yet.
AJ:No, they've got a podcast too S.
Karen:Oh yeah, so the podcast just came out with us.
AJ:It did. Did you see it? I've been reading the book.
Karen:Well, the podcast just came out, two hours ago.
AJ:Two hours ago. There you go.
Karen:It's an interview with me and Lorenzo. The podcast from Scene.
Lorenzo:How you doing? Hello, good mate, how are you?
AJ:It's a pleasure to see you again.
Lorenzo:Yes.
AJ:Thanks for squeezing me in. I know you're really busy.
Lorenzo:It's been a little busy, though, especially during the month of February.
Karen:Yeah, really.
Lorenzo:We're not in March. Now February and March.
Karen:Yeah.
Lorenzo:But we've been pretty busy.
AJ:Yeah, I hear you it sounds good though. Yeah, lorenzo, this is where we met the other day, at the entrance to the museum at the famed Jefferson Street Sound tree. Let's welcome listeners in, like you welcomed us in that day, hey.
Lorenzo:Yeah, well, to start off and I always like starting off saying this was my home, this wasn't a museum in the beginning. This is where I lived, and I turned my home into a museum, like one room at a time. Until now it's swallowed up my whole house. I've got one room in the back that I live in.
AJ:So did you pick this up after it had been a boarding house?
Lorenzo:Oh yeah much much further down the road when it was a boarding house. It was in the 50s and 60s when some of the artists and musicians that went to Tennessee State and that was around here Now. The main thing, tennessee State did not have enough boarding for all of the students, for the music students, so they came out into the community and rented larger houses and put the kids in the rooms in these large houses and then after that boarding houses. So we had boarding houses all up and down Jefferson Street and in the North Nashville community.
AJ:I'm imagining that was part of the magic of the place.
Lorenzo:Yeah, it brought a closeness to the musicians and artists that lived in these boarding houses, because they hung out at night, you know, and sang and played and wrote music together. Hung out at night, you know, and sang and played and wrote music together. So it was a lot of that going on in these boarding houses here in the city and this was one of them. Now, like Hank Crawford, Hank Crawford was a saxophone player and Hank Crawford got picked up by Ray Charles. So actually Ray Charles has been in this house to pick up his saxophone player to go on tour, to do gigs. So Ray Charles has spent some time in this house.
AJ:It's fitting that this should happen to become the museum ultimately, when it's got that sort of a backdrop. But what was the moment for you where you thought I've got to do this?
Lorenzo:well, uh, that I've got to do this museum now. Uh, I was inspired by Miss Mary and James and some of the other older artists to do this museum thing because they was coming here to rehearse and to jam. I had a room over here that was a rehearsal hall and I would allow them to come in and rehearse and jam, because they were getting older and they weren't getting the gigs. You know, like that's what they called it gigs, yeah they weren't getting the gigs like, uh, they were.
Lorenzo:So I would allow them to come over and hang out here in my spot now and when they would finish. When they would finish, they would come over here in my apartment and this part of the building was my apartment and they would come over here and stand around, sit around and maybe have a beer or two and just talk trash about what they did and who they played with. Because jimmy hendrix played in marion james's band at one time, did he really? Yeah, he played behind my best friend, herbert herbert hunter, uh, at one time. So at one time jimmy would just be getting gigs with whoever he could get gigs with in order to pay his rent.
Lorenzo:You know, and I used to see Jimmy walk up and down this street here, which is Jefferson Street, walk up and down this street with his guitar on his shoulder and just moseying around up Jefferson Street and down Jefferson Street, because he lived five blocks down the street and he worked six blocks down the street. So his home, his, the building he lived in, which was a boarding house again, upstairs was the boarding area and downstairs there was a beauty school, joyce's House of Glamour, and Jimmy lived upstairs. Him and Billy Cox had a room.
AJ:He had rooms upstairs.
Lorenzo:You know it was a house like this, yeah, and so they lived right down the street. So you could see Jimmy up and down Jefferson Street any time. Billy Cox had a little po, he had a little monkey, and he'd walk this little monkey even up and down Jefferson Street, you know. So it was a lot going on. Everybody claimed Jefferson Street. You know. Everybody had stories about Jefferson Street on Jefferson Street and everybody that touched Jefferson Street put their footprints on Jefferson Street, was proud. This was a proud community here on Jefferson in North Nashville.
AJ:Well, there's a display right now in the Country Music Hall of Fame that we went to yesterday on Jefferson Street. I think they're calling it the Night Train to Nashville exhibit. And in that they've got a passage from Jimmy where he says he really learned how to play guitar here.
Lorenzo:Here on Jefferson, not on Jefferson, on Jefferson Street, because Johnny Jones was a guitar player and Johnny, you know, told me this story himself that he had a job at a little club up there in Clarksville and Jimmy was in the Army at the time, he was a paratrooper at Fort Campbell and he used to come down to this little club that he worked at Johnny Jones worked at and sit around and listen to him and they said, like in Seattle they didn't have the blues. The blues wasn't in Seattle. So Jimmy could play, but he couldn't play the blues. And when he met up with Johnny Jones and found out that Johnny Jones was in Nashville right after he got released from the service, he came to Nashville following Johnny Jones and Johnny Jones said that he hung around him a lot and that's how he learned how to play the blues is hanging around Johnny Jones. But when he got good enough he thought he was good enough to challenge Johnny Jones in a battle and Johnny Jones beat him in the guitar battle. And Johnny said that he was already set up in the club, the Club Baron, right down the street.
Lorenzo:That one's still there? Yeah, it's still there yeah.
Lorenzo:He said he was set up in the club to play a gig that night and Jimmy came in with one of his buddies talking trash that he was ready yeah, I'm ready for you, I'm ready.
Lorenzo:And his buddy was talking more trash than Jimmy, you know. And Johnny said I told him to come on up and plug in and he brought his little amp. He said he had a little amp and he brought the amp up and set it up and plugged in and he said they got started. And Johnny said I had two big old speakers with two 15-inch woofers in them and Jimmy had this little box that looked like it might have had a couple of 12s in it or something. And he said when we got started, he said I like to blow them out of the water because I was loud, much louder than he was, plus I'm an aggressive player, and so he said, said I beat him. He said that Johnny Jones said I got all of the applause because I was good and loud and I'm good and all this is just the tip of the iceberg.
AJ:Mean I look behind you on this famous tree that you've set up with. Well, not even all the artists, but a lot of the artists that came through and a lot of the clubs they played at. This street was really full of it.
Lorenzo:It was full and these clubs that you see on this tree was the larger ones. It didn't show all of the ones in between these which were smaller clubs, but we got clubs. I'm going to start over here. We got Price's Dinner Club, now Price's. A lot of artists played at Price's. We had Tom Malone, marion James played there. We had Tom Malone, mary and James played there, christine Cottrell, benny Lattimore played there, but one of the main ones that's not on the tree was Fats Domino. Fats Domino, when he would come to Nashville he'd go right to Price's because they were friends and he'd always go to Prices. So that was Fats Domino's spot. And over here at the Club Baron is where Little Richard made his home on Jefferson Street. That was the club that he performed at every weekend. Wow.
AJ:Marvin.
Lorenzo:Gaye.
AJ:Yeah, marvin Gaye, yeah, marvin.
Lorenzo:Gaye played there.
AJ:D Ford Bailey. You've got a big stand-up painting here of him as well.
Lorenzo:Right right, otis Redding, otis Redding, Bobby Bluebland, and then we had the Black Diamond. The Black Diamond was a club. That building is still standing. It's a restaurant now, but it was sort of like a spillover. You know, if everything else was full, you might go by the Black Diamond. That's the way I explained it. There was more or less a spillover there. And then you had the club still away. At the club still away, you might catch Ike and Tina Turner in the club still away, aretha Franklin played the club still away Del Marocco as well.
Lorenzo:She was performing at she performed, yeah, all around the different clubs. Jimmy Church.
AJ:Oh, Lucius Talley, who we saw here with you the other night. Yeah, yeah, Lucius.
Lorenzo:Spoonman. Now, lucius used to be a drummer, yeah, you know. So that's how he got on the map here. It was before he started playing spoons.
AJ:Another namesake, Etta James Mm-hmm playing spoons.
Lorenzo:Another namesake Etta James, mm-hmm. Now Etta James cut her first live album at the New Era Club. Oh, right here, her first live Rock. The House was the name of that album.
AJ:James Brown down there too.
Lorenzo:Mm-hmm. Now, when the artists, when they came to Nashville, the first place that most of them wanted to play at is the New Era Club, because that's where the local crowd is. You know the local crowd was at the New Era and you know you're going to have a packed house every weekend night at the New Era, every weekend night at the New Era. So when artists come to Nashville they want to check out the New Era just because of that local crowd. You know that's where I went. You know a lot back then that's the first place that I would go is the New Era Club. Yeah, magnificent.
AJ:And then there came a time after this period, the 40s to the 70s where it came to a screeching halt To talk about this. What initiated that? Why don't we step outside onto the street to get? A visceral sense. I mean, listeners are probably hearing some of the traffic behind us, but that's just yeah but that was Jefferson Street.
Lorenzo:You heard traffic sirens, probably hearing some of the traffic behind us, but that's just yeah, but that was jefferson street.
AJ:You know, you hear traffic siren and uh, all of that was on jefferson street so we, as we step outside onto jefferson street now let's follow that thread and talk about what changed in the 70s street sound and that covers all of the sounds that may have taken place or that was here on jefferson street.
Lorenzo:now you have to imagine over 600 and something homes and businesses up and down the street, so you had people up and down the street. Like right there on the corner used to be a little grocery store right there on the corner, across the street, it was an instrument, a shop where they sold used instruments. So it was artists and musicians in and out of that shop over there all the time. Right here next door it was an ice cream parlor, so you had an ice cream parlor there and you had all of these artists and musicians living in this boarding house right here.
Lorenzo:So you had all of that kind of action right here, but you had houses next to each other, next door to each other. You had them all the way up jefferson street and you had little kids up and down jefferson street. Now you don't see kids on this street. There's no kids. But uh, in the uh, 60s and the 70s and 50s, 60s and 70s and 50s, 60s and 70s, it was just people lined up, all of these students. That was up and down Jefferson Street. You had libraries down the street, insurance companies, car dealerships, grocery stores, clothing stores. You had all of that up and down Jefferson Street car dealerships, grocery stores, clothing stores.
AJ:You had all of that up and down Jefferson Street. It's funny that development should have been thought of as taking away everything that you've already got and that you need.
Lorenzo:Yeah, but it was planned for them to take away this community, to put the interstate right through it, to drain the interstate. Now they didn't even tell the community what they were going to do. Really they didn't even, they didn't warn the community that they would go out in the Bellmead area and put up flyers or something to let them know that they are getting ready to cut through Jefferson, cut through North Nashville. But they didn't bring those same flyers and that same information to the actual community, to the actual community. So when they came through the community with the bulldozers and the trucks and all of that, the plan had already been made years before and I heard they started planning this interstate in the 50s, around 55 or something. But they didn't actually start working on the interstate until the early 60s, 63, 64, 5.
Lorenzo:And in 67, they were driving down the interstate. In 67, they were driving down there in the state and they didn't even want to put a ramp, an off-ramp on Jefferson Street where you had the three universities over here. Still, most of the clubs were gone. Even in the back of this building. They took the backyard, we, you, the backyard, went all the way to the alley and the alley and all of that's gone. Yeah, yeah when we pulled up.
AJ:We're right between the building and the interstate and the interstate, so that explains see the interstate went back to the next street, I mean the backyard.
Lorenzo:You had big backyards, yeah, but not now, no more. So with all that was going on and just like you hear the traffic here here but you hit, the only emergency hospital in the black community was right up the street here, herbert Hospital, and that's the hospital that I was born in, right here on Jefferson Street. So it was a lot going on and a lot to do here on this street, but the interstate brought the change to Jefferson Street in the early 60s.
AJ:Let's go back in. We've got the visceral sense of that now, but we'll go back where it's quieter. The visceral sense of that now, but we'll go back where it's quieter. I can only imagine, Lorenzo, what that felt like at the time to be ambushed by that sort of a change. Yeah, what was the sense in the community then?
Lorenzo:Well, we felt that they wanted our community Because right after they came through here with the interstate, they didn't do anything to protect the community.
Lorenzo:As far as you know, they didn't have good police presence, as far as you know, they didn't have good police presence. There were garbage, you know not, but trash, you know, on the streets. You didn't see the street sweepers coming through very often or the prisoners coming through with the brooms and the dustpans and dust pans. So we were really let down by the lack of attention that this community was getting after the interstate came through here. But the thing is and I've heard that the plan was for it to be like this today, you know, with the tall and skinnies coming up, yeah, with the access to the interstate. You know, for the people on the other end of Jefferson Street that has big businesses down there, but they can get to the interstate right down the street here down there, but they can get to the interstate right down the street here. And that was something that they needed and they got. They got Jefferson Street, they got the interstate and they got the community.
AJ:When I said they, they government the city. It comes hot on the heels of the civil rights movement that you lived through as well, and I read in your book the other day that your granddad's granddad was a slave, did secure the 40 acres in a mule, unlike many that had it sort of taken back.
Lorenzo:But we only got 24 acres, did you? Because they sold off some of the acres? There we go.
AJ:So your life has also lived through a lot of that marginalisation. How was it for you growing up in that You've maintained such a disposition, a positive disposition to people? How did you do that?
Lorenzo:Well, when I was a kid, you know, we lived in a neighborhood across, just across the bridge. It wasn't far away now, a mile and a half, but we lived in a community where it was black and whites living in the community. Some of our best friends were white kids. They lived in that area that we lived in. It was sort of like it was a rural area but it was mixed with black and whites.
Lorenzo:And on this hill up here some of my best friends, bubba Fields that's what his nickname was, bubba Fields, their last name was Field. They had a horse and some cows and chickens and that kind of stuff on their farm. A little old farm, kind of shabby, but you know it was a farm and we lived down the hill here and we had a little four-room house down there and it was like seven, eight of us living in that house in the head of kitchen. So it didn't have but two rooms. That was considered bed, no, three rooms was considered bedrooms and then the kitchen. There wasn't no living room or none of that. It didn't have that much space in it.
Lorenzo:But we lived in that little house on Wichita Street but Bubba Fields and them up here on this end. We used to go to their house some weekends and spend the night and then we'd get up in the mornings we'd ride the horse and ride the cow and rode the cow and rode the cow and he had a little motorcycle and we'd ride the little motorcycle. So we had a ball up there at Bubba Fields Now. But Bubba Fields used to love to come to our house and spend the night because of my mother's cooking. She'd cook a big breakfast and spend the night because of my mother's cooking. She'd cook a big breakfast. She'd have eggs and fried chicken and biscuits, you know, for breakfast and he loved to come to our house for breakfast. We loved to go there because he had the cows and the horses.
AJ:I should clarify too biscuits here are what we call scones back home. So people think biscuits, but they're more like cookies for us. Cookies for breakfast, what? No, they're scones, we call them.
Lorenzo:Oh scones.
AJ:Yeah, so scones for breakfast Sounds lovely. Oh, and so a nod to your mother too, because I have to say, like, right behind you, it's almost my favourite feature of this museum is her old turntable.
Lorenzo:Yeah, this is a turntable here we call it a record player because it played records, because it played records and it had a radio also and that was the old record player that my mother you'd go in the house and hear the music. You know it wasn't no big deal and that's just what they played music on after we got electricity. Because, uh, we didn't get electricity until I was about 12 years old and we got electricity. That's when we could play.
Lorenzo:You know, something like this but uh, and the backwater man. We remember the backwater would come through every year and old Bubba Field and them had a boat. Laughter, they had a. It was a paddle boat, you know, but they had a boat, you know when the backwater come about, every three years the backwater would come in and the backwater would get this high in our house.
AJ:Like chest high.
Lorenzo:Yeah, chest high in the house and we'd have to wait until the water go down. And when the water would go down we'd have to go in and scrub the walls down and the floors and move back in.
AJ:This is fascinating because I mean, I take it that's the Cumberland River. That would do that. The Cumberland River, and what stopped it? Are there dams upstream now?
Lorenzo:The dams.
AJ:Yeah, it's interesting because, because like right now down there.
Lorenzo:Do you know they got all of those apartments and uh housing down there.
Lorenzo:Yes, and we were wondering well, what are they going to do about the backwater? But they fixed the backwater. You know, downstream, yeah, yeah, the dams and stuff interesting. So they're not concerned with the backwater because the backwater used to come up and come across Jefferson Street. You couldn't go straight down Jefferson Street, you'd have to turn at 10th and go around and come back down at 6th, 5th, 5th and 6th and get back on Jefferson, because the backwater would have part of Jefferson Street cut off.
AJ:So amongst a range of things. What's really interesting to me is that you still describe your childhood as full of love and happiness.
Lorenzo:Yeah, but that was just how we were taught. You know, my mother was a kind, good, good lady and we picked that up from her. She had me going through the neighborhood taking care of the little old ladies in the neighborhood, cutting the grass and running to the store for them. I was doing that at eight, seven, eight years old, you know, doing for the neighbors, especially the ladies, and so we were taking care of them back when I was seven, eight years old. So I learned kindness through my mother and it came with me. You know, right today, you know, if I see a person, especially an older person, in need, although I'm an older, person.
Karen:now I almost got a sigh.
Lorenzo:You know I have arised, you know, but the way I look at it, you know, I don't feel, you know, that older person, you know. So I'm still looking to help, so I'm still looking to help.
AJ:Well, let's walk through a little bit, hey, and come back to how you arrived.
Lorenzo:Like you set, this up in what was it 2011? How you?
AJ:arrived decades later thinking I've got to do this. What was that spark or that compulsion?
Lorenzo:that made you start. Well, see, marion James and these older artists were still living. Yeah, yeah, you know most of them has died out since I started the museum, and so I was encouraged and inspired, you know, to continue on. And then, once most of them passed, then I said I've got to do it now in order to keep their legacy going. And that's what I did, even when they came here from the Smithsonian Mrs Ruskins, she's up there with Michael Gray, michael Gray with the white shirt on Well, he's over at the Country Music Hall of Fame and she's from the Smithsonian near Washington, and she's from the Smithsonian near Washington. And they came and they asked me if I could pull some of the artists together that grew up, you know, here on Jefferson Street, grew up performing, and I said yeah, because I was sort of in touch with them, and so I pulled together this group right here. There's Miss Marion James, oh wow, she's deceased. Now there's Frank Howard he's still performing. There's Jesse Boyce. Jesse Boyce is deceased now. There's Nick Nixon, and Nick Nixon is deceased now.
Lorenzo:And there's Clifford Curry. Clifford Curry is deceased. There's D Ford Bailey I'm sure you've heard of him you heard. His daddy is what they're promoting now. And there's pictures of him right there. Yeah, incredible story. And he's deceased now. And there's pictures of him right there, yeah, incredible story. And he's deceased now. And there's Spoon man Spoon man Lucy, spoon man Talley. And there's Jimmy Church. And there is Don Adams oh, wow, and this gentleman here, jimmy Odie. Jimmy Odie was the drummer for James, not James Brown, little Richard, for a few years.
AJ:Yeah, so you were the conduit for these bigger institutions. Yeah as well, yeah.
Lorenzo:Even with the African American Museum downtown. I went down and told some of my story and they brought a whole busload of their people here to learn my stories and I didn't think I had any stories worth telling that meant anything until I started getting doing interviews and and I'm I'm not a good interviewer I tell folk in a minute. I'm not great at interviewing at all. I just tell my story and hope you take it, uh, like it's presented to you.
AJ:you know from the heart uh, like it's presented to you. You know from the heart, the best kind you know. So you started in 2011 and on that note, then we were talking the other day, I said did it take off straight away or did it take a bit of time? And you said it took a bit of time and as much because, like we're talking, a few years and as much because you needed to build your confidence up in the way that you're describing yeah, and I said so.
AJ:You started it before you were confident oh yeah, yeah, I was.
Lorenzo:I was scared to death to get in front of a microphone. I you know that was one of the worst things you could do to me is put a microphone in front of me, you know, uh, but now I have a different kind of confidence. It's not that I feel like I'm good at it or anything, is that? Uh, just go on and tell your story. Yeah, you know, that's, that's. That's where I'm at now. I'll just go on and tell you know, and try to answer the questions as best that I can.
AJ:Right on. Okay, so we've moved into this room. Let's bring listeners back into how it feels we're in this. What was this room? Was this your dining room? This was my living room. It was your living room and it's full of. I'll put photos up on the website. It's full of these images, some of which you've been referring to. I've got your book to my right here. I've got an extraordinary display here. You said it was the first item in here, I think did you One of the first?
Lorenzo:That's one of the first articles that I put on the walls. It started with that wall back there and then this wall, and how did that?
AJ:come to be here and then this wall.
Lorenzo:And how did that come to be here? Well, because they were the walls that I felt you could see first when you come in here. This wall was right here where you could see it when you come in the room, and that wall was next to the stairwell here where you go up and down to the studio. And most of these artists on this people on this wall had something to do with hip-hop, the rap musics. I had a couple of rappers that I helped promote, along with Don Adams there Now Don Adams did the first album that we had here on Jefferson Street. I don't know of another album being cut and released on Jefferson Street before Don Adams, and that was here in the museum.
AJ:That was here in the museum upstairs and now you're getting instruments donated. It's become a real place where people are giving more and more things like these two pianos.
Lorenzo:Right right, these pianos were donated. The one on that side was donated by Dr WO Smith's daughter, jackie Smith, and Jackie was a singer a jazz singer and she ended up moving from Nashville to California and she didn't have room for the piano, so she donated the piano to the museum. Now this piano over here was donated by Marion James's cousin and she wrote her only hit record on that piano.
Lorenzo:And that hit record was that's my man and it was a 45. And she wrote the song playing this piano and that was the only hit song that she wrote.
AJ:It's an amazing song. Well, so are the rest of them Hits or not? Yeah, right.
Lorenzo:She was a romantic singer. She sung about romantic things all the time.
AJ:Yeah. And then we cut left into a room that's sort of notable for being full of framed photos and old promotional posters. Right.
Lorenzo:This is the room where most of the artifacts are. And most of these artifacts were donated by different artists and some by friends of artists you know and relatives of different artists. Now this vest right here was donated by Jesse Boyce and Jesse played bass guitar for Little Richard. There's a picture of him up there and Jesse played with Little Richard for about 20 years. And Jesse Boyce also got picked up by Barry Gordy at Motown and he ended up leaving Nashville and going to Detroit and playing with Motown writing for Motown for four or five years. Matter of fact, that guitar up there on the wall was Jesse Boyce's guitar and on that guitar he wrote the song firefly and he got a platinum record for that song firefly that the temptations uh recorded, yeah, and he wrote it on that, wrote the song on that guitar and about three weeks before he died he brought that guitar over here and signed it and donated it to the museum. So that's a treasured piece. And Jesse was also one of my business partners when I got into the music in 75. In the record store In the record, moses Dillard and Jesse Boyce had a production company, dillard and Boyce Production, and they were over on Music Row.
Lorenzo:Matter of fact, they were the first black production company to be accepted on Music Row and they seeked me out of the community to come and partner with them. So I did and I was one of the partners. I went from the record store, I had a record store, I went from owning a record store to being a part of the record business and those guys cut one album and the album is in there in the case. Cut an album Saturday Night Band Come On, dance, dance. They got two Grammy nominations, yeah, and you were on it.
AJ:Yeah, you wrote a piece.
Lorenzo:Yeah, I wrote a piece on the second one.
AJ:But you said you had no idea about music. No, I didn't. How did you do? But you said you had no idea about music. No, I didn't.
Lorenzo:How did you do that? I didn't have no idea about none of this stuff, but here I am, you know, in a serious conversation about all this stuff.
AJ:And you've got awards. Can I say they're coming out of your ears now.
Lorenzo:Yeah, I've gotten quite a few Getting ready to go to Knoxville tomorrow to receive another award. So, yeah, I've gotten notoriety from all of this stuff that I'm doing.
AJ:You've got a day named after you.
Lorenzo:Yeah, I've got a day named after you. Yeah, got a day named after me. One of the April the 3rd here in Nashville, tennessee, is my day. It's a given day for Lorenzo Washington Day. Whoever would have expected that kind of stuff?
AJ:you know, it must say something. I think it says a lot about our deep appreciation for the stories of our places.
Lorenzo:Yeah, yeah, and it's all about the stories. You know what folk want to hear. When they come in this little museum, they look at the pictures, but how does it relate to what took place on Jefferson Street my stories?
AJ:Right on. So what happens next with this place then? Where are you heading with it now?
Lorenzo:Well, we've got a couple of programs that we've implemented and one the main one that's going to take us forward with the museum and with the stories and with the talent, is Seymour S-Y-M-O-R. Start your Month Off Right, and that's a feature that we've gotten started here and we feature different artists and we have an open mic kind of thing doing part of the Seymour Night, and what we're doing is bringing the community, the musical community, back together. You know, through the open mic and the Seymour featuring artists, that kind of thing. We do it the first Monday of every month, for right now, when it gets warm, we'll take it outside.
AJ:And we had that story night.
Lorenzo:you know the legacy story night the other night, yeah, the legacy night we have it, where we are interviewing some of the older artists and getting their story down on tape, you know. So one day we'll be able to play these tapes and let them tell you some of their stories about what took place on Jefferson.
AJ:Street. I was curious too, because in that conversation you articulated a vision of a dinner club.
Lorenzo:Oh yeah, that's my vision. I don't know if nobody else has that vision. Karen may have joined in with me on that vision, but what I'd like to see on the street or in this community is a nice dinner club that would hold about 110, 15 people and bring in artists from around the country that sing the blues. You know people that's just getting started that don't cost you a lot of money and let them perform some of these old songs that these older musicians would perform and just have good food and good music back here on Jefferson Street.
AJ:Given the reaction to this museum, I can't see how it wouldn't work.
Lorenzo:Well, it just takes a bunch of money, wouldn't work. Well, it just takes a bunch of money. You know it's going to take a few million dollars to buy the properties you know and build a building.
AJ:But the money's coming in in one form or other, isn't it at the moment? So just a bit of it that way.
Lorenzo:Well, just enough to keep us keep the stories going.
AJ:Yeah, it's a beautiful vision, yeah, and notable, having watched the PBS story Exit 207, about the interstate coming through and transforming this community.
AJ:but then about your work was also the work of Carlos with the Nashville Black Market, and we went to the Black Market last Friday. Oh, you did, yeah, the first one for the year, apparently, as things are starting to thaw out a bit, yeah. And yeah, the way he was with you on that show too, looked like a real I don't know his passing of the baton, too much to say, but it's a similar ilk. He's gone and set up this black market, african-american market, small business, music, amazing food, kids on the street. It was that vibe. So sure now it's, it's over there, but still on, still connected to jefferson, connected yeah and and there is next generation coming on with this stuff too.
AJ:Are you seeing a bit of that?
Lorenzo:yeah, well, it's not a lot, but it has to start somewhere, and carlos is, and Carlos has sort of fell into that mold that I'd like to see take place here on Jefferson Street.
Lorenzo:And you have to have nerve, you know, to step out front to do these things that we're doing to try to revive the community, the street.
Lorenzo:And I'm not just saying the street, I'm saying the community, because now we've got Buckhannon up here and Buckhannon they're investing more in that street because it was more property, it was more real estate, you know, over there on Buckhannon than it was on Jefferson Street, because here on Jefferson Street you got the interstate bagged right up to the properties over here on Jefferson Street so you don't have the footage. You know, going back, just like back here, you know it stops right there. Now you couldn't put a parking lot back there. You know you can park four or five cars and then they're going to catch the blues getting out of there if it's that many, you know. So you have to. You just have to be careful how you spend your money when you come over here on Jefferson, you know, and you have to have a lot of nerve to come over here and invest, because you're going to have some years before you recoup your first money you know, it's going to take you three or four years to establish yourself, and to a point of making a profit.
Lorenzo:Now, can you afford those three or four years?
AJ:It seems like a small price to pay for what you gain, and I'm looking at you having transformed your house into this and seeing what it's flowering that you had that patience.
Lorenzo:Yeah, but instead of me it taking three or four years, it took 13 years. Yeah yeah, you know, but I have lived through those 13 years. I have lived past those 13 years, and so that's why I'm able to stand here and talk to you, because I endured.
AJ:Would you do it again? Are there key lessons or pieces of advice out of your experience?
Lorenzo:If I was the age that I was 13 years ago, I might would say yeah, but being that I'm 13 years older than those years, I probably would say no.
AJ:Yeah. If it was now, yeah, I probably would say no. Yeah, yeah, if it was now, yeah, I probably would say no, but there was a bigger drive for you, it was a bigger call, it just had to be done.
Lorenzo:Yeah, yeah, yeah. I felt that in my heart that it needed to be done.
AJ:And as you went.
Lorenzo:Then you found a way. Yeah, I found a way. You know how do you explain that Now? That I can't explain that I can't explain.
AJ:Yeah, really Endurance you know, I'm really interested in this bit that you can't explain, because this is a common story, right? People just feel that they've got to do it, and they do their thing. It turns out incredible, inspires so many people, and and then other people are sitting there going, oh I couldn't do it. I couldn't do what I'm thinking of, though. It'd be pretty hard.
Lorenzo:I'd have to be in it for years before any money came back, or whatever right, right, right now, uh, a couple of my friends, uh, friends, one of them bought him a new Corvette, one of them bought him a Lexus and one of them lives in one of these tall and skinnies overlooking downtown. Now I say, that could have been me. Yes, exactly, I could have afforded that at one time, you know, but I chose to grind it out here in this little museum. I decided that I was not going to allow the legacy of these great artists and musicians, and especially the ones that didn't make it to stardom. I was not going to let them down, you know, I was going to do something to keep their heads held high.
Lorenzo:And that's what I did with this little museum, because now it's being known around the world, not just here in Nashville, not just here in North Nashville. It's gone from just the folk around here knowing about it to now you spreading the word in Australia, and it's been spreaded in Australia, and it's been spread in Europe, in France, in Canada, in Mexico. So it's being spread all around now. And we're going. Now they're calling us to come to different places to pick up these different awards, us to come to different places to pick up these different awards. And so now we're being awarded for keeping this museum alive and keeping the people in this museum alive.
AJ:Yep, as I stand here, I feel like I'm surrounded in riches, so here's to that. To close, lorenzo, extremely fitting in this context, I actually ask my guests what music would we go out with after this conversation? Is there a piece that stands out in your mind right now or something that's been with you for a long time, maybe when you were a kid?
Lorenzo:Well, the piece now that goes out is back in the day that Marian James sung, and it's about Jefferson Street.
AJ:Brilliant. We've been listening to Marian since we were here on Saturday.
Lorenzo:But you hadn't heard this one on Marian back in the day and it sings about the clubs. Let me see if I can come up with something here just to give you a quick listen, right?
Marion James:Nashville, tennessee, that's history. On a road named Jefferson Street. Back in the day, that was all the gold Gateway. Back in the day, that was all the gold Gateway, jefferson Street. Jazz and Blues that is the road. Oh, up in Jefferson you could stop at Good Jelly John. You could get a little moonshine and wine and it's close. You could slide on in there, have a good time. Back in the day, that was all the gold Jefferson Street. Jazz and blues that is the road. Back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, oh Lord, that was all ago. Twelting jellies, son, you could stop at Stoops and eat a little barbecue Right across the street. Now, y'all, you can have a good time At Cozy Corner too. Ease on down.
Marion James:The club still awake. Johnny Jones and Jimmy Church Just began to play Browns Dental Club. Charles Dungeon played his play. Sounds so good. Now Kinda wanna get up, shake up the mass play.
Marion James:Back in the day, that was all the gold Gateway, jefferson Street. That is the road Back in the day in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day, back in the day. Oh Lord, that was all ago. From Fish University to TSU, you could have a ball at Club Demarocco too. Jimmy Henry, billy Cox on bass, island Boy Sam, not letting the music go to waste. Club baron, oh, it's ready. Little Richard too. Oh hey, having a Sunday jam just for you. Don't forget, girl. Behind the green door when they play, don't forget the prize. Behind the green door when they play, everyone hit the floor. That's every day, that's the street every day. That's every dayets were street jazz and blues Back in the day. Oh yeah, that was all ago. One more time now. Back in the day, oh hey, back in the day. One more time now. Back, back, back, back, ah hey, back, back, back, back, back, back back Talking about a little girl Playing, back, back, back back.
Lorenzo:Couldn't miss her. She's gonna meet Jackie Shane too. Really Back, back, back back.
Marion James:Ah, ah, ah, ah, back, back, back, back, really Back in the day, back in the day. That was all the time. Back in the day, Back in the day, back in the day.
AJ:Back in the day. What album is that?
Lorenzo:off. It's a single that she did for me. Oh, really yeah, and we produced it right here upstairs. She couldn't go up the steps when she did this, so she sat right in there beside the table and we brought microphones downstairs to her and she recorded it sitting right in there in that room.
AJ:No way.
Lorenzo:Yeah, that's brilliant, and we brought a band in different band members. Oh, the band's brilliant, and we brought a band in different band members.
AJ:Oh, the band was great. That's amazing, lorenzo, I'm so glad you played that. Yeah Well, lorenzo, I can't thank you enough. I love what you guys are doing, thank you. Thanks for speaking with me.
Lorenzo:Yes sir, yes sir.
AJ:That was Lorenzo Washington, founder and curator of the Jefferson Street Sound Museum. I've put a bunch of photos on the website and, of course, various links in the show notes. As usual, I'll have more for paid subscribers on Patreon and Substack soon, a great thanks for making it all possible. You can join these great people by heading to the website or the show notes and following the prompts. The music you're hearing is Regeneration by Amelia Barden. My name's Anthony James. Thanks for listening. Than yo yo.
